Why High-Achieving Women Burn Out with Jasmyn Quianna

Are you burned out… or have you simply lost yourself trying to hold everything together?

In this powerful episode of SHE Asked: Tools for Practical Hope, therapist and coach Anna McBride sits down with author and self-love mentor Jasmyn Quianna for an honest conversation about burnout, nervous system healing, perfectionism, people pleasing, emotional exhaustion, and why so many high-achieving women struggle to trust themselves.

Jasmyn shares her journey from corporate success and chronic burnout to deep healing and self-reconnection — revealing how high performers often abandon themselves in pursuit of achievement, validation, safety, and external success.

Together, Anna and Jasmyn explore:
✨ Burnout recovery & nervous system regulation
✨ Why successful women still feel unhappy
✨ The difference between survival mode and true alignment
✨ Why self-love is really self-remembrance

If you’ve ever felt disconnected from yourself, stuck in survival mode, afraid to slow down, or exhausted from constantly proving your worth — this episode is for you.

ABOUT JASMYN QUIANNA:
Jasmyn Quianna is the founder of the Absolute Self Love movement and author of Falling Madly in Self Love. Her work helps ambitious women heal burnout, rebuild self-trust, regulate their nervous systems, and reconnect to who they truly are beneath performance and perfectionism.

✨Book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0GJRDZVCY/

✨Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasmynquianna

✨Website: https://jasmynquianna.com

🎧 Listen now and begin your journey back to yourself

✨ Learn more about Anna McBride’s coaching, retreats & workshops:
www.annamcbride.com

#BurnoutRecovery #SelfLove #NervousSystemHealing #HighAchievingWomen #PeoplePleasing #EmotionalHealing #SelfTrust #WomenHealing #MentalHealthPodcast #SomaticHealing #HealingJourney #TherapistPodcast #PersonalGrowth #WomenEmpowerment

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Transcript

Welcome And Guest Background

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Welcome back to She Asked: Tools for Practical Hope. I'm your host, Anna McBride, and I am so glad you're here. Today I'm joined by Jasmine Kiana, author of Falling Madly in Self-Love, and founder of the Absolute Self-Love Movement. Jasmine's work centers around helping high-achieving women rebuild self-trust, not through more strategy or effort, but through identity-level healing and nervous system work. Jasmine, I'm so excited that you're here. Welcome to She Ask.

SPEAKER_00 0:44

Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

That's great. Thank you for being

Chasing Success Until Breakdown

SPEAKER_01 0:49

here. As always on our show, we like to begin with the story. So, Jasmine, please take us back to the beginning of your story, the one that led you into this life and work that you're leading today.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

So, my story. It started out with me doing science research at a lab and a bench, working with the cells and the tubes and the small animal models. And me thinking that was like my new way to success because I originally wanted to be a physician and I found out that I didn't like their lifestyle. So I was thinking, okay, the only other thing I'd know to help people heal, because that was my thing. I wanted to do something to help people heal, was to go on the other side, which was the scientist side. Keeping in mind when I made this choice, I had already knew from being an undergrad that I did not like doing experiments or doing that type of research work. But what else was I gonna do? That was the practical, safe, known way, the reasonable way to help people make impact and then at the same time make some decent money. So even though I knew with my gut and my soul that wasn't it, I just felt okay, I can make the most out of it, and it'll be like maybe a means to an end type of thing. So, long story short, my soul said no. And I ended up leaving graduate school early because I just it was just so out of alignment. Every day was miserable. So then I went into the clinical research space thinking, okay, at least I'm working with people. So that should be different. Still trying to override my soul at the time. Definitely that's not what I was thinking. I'm just thinking, well, I'm burned out or I'm overwhelmed or I just haven't found the right fit or I need to check more boxes, right? And so I did it. I broke into the industry. It took a while, but I broke into the industry. I climbed that corporate ladder. I got the promotions, the titles, the salary, all the things, but I reached that place again, the same thing as before. And this, okay, what's going on? I I can't keep changing. I'm getting older. I don't have time for this. Like all the things flooded into my head. Like, what else am I gonna do? This was the last option. There's nothing else. So then I started a coaching business, a career coaching business, helping people get in that same clinical research industry because again, I wanted to help people, right? So that felt right. That felt good. And building it alongside my corporate career. But of course, I reached the same place again. And that's when I reached this total meltdown place because it's like I've done all the things at this point. I had the external success, but internally I feel miserable, I feel awful, unfulfilled. I feel worse than I did when I was actually broke on government assistance, pregnant in my parents' basement, no job, student loans, all this debt. Like I felt worse than then. So I it then is wrong with me. Why can't you just be happy? Like you check the boxes, you have this what on paper, anyway, is success. And then that's when I had these breakdowns, and then I reached this awakening point, which eventually led me to write my book and start my new business and essentially help women with the same challenge, the same struggle, reaching the same place that I they find themselves in, the same place that I was in, and helping them re relearn how to trust themselves, reconnect with themselves so they can finally give themselves permission to choose the life that they deserve, essentially.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

Wow, yeah. What is it about us high-achieving women that we have to go through such a breakdown to have any kind of breakthrough? Oh my goodness. And yet we keep chasing it, don't we? We're gonna figure it out. Yes, yes, wow, wow, yeah. So when you were in that season, on outside being successful, but on the inside just feeling out of alignment, so disconnected.

The Body’s Early Warning System

SPEAKER_01 5:00

What were the subtle signs that something wasn't right?

SPEAKER_00 5:05

So subtle, not so subtle. Um but at the time, of course, they were subtle because you're not making any type of connection, right? But like headaches and pounding headaches, migraine types of headaches, and not just here and there, but at first they're kind of here and there, but then they start to kind of come weekly and then maybe every other day. And then next thing you know, it's daily, and then next thing you know, you've had the same headache for the whole week.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

And thinking, maybe I need to eat because I was working from home. Even when I was traveling for work, eating is the last thing on your mind because you have all these things to do, right? And they're more important than taking care of your body. So I'm thinking, maybe it's because I need to eat, or maybe it's because I need to rest because you're not sleeping enough, right? Or if you are sleeping eight hours, but then the quality sucks. So that's those things are things that were on the list too. Not sleeping, not poor, poorly eating. I would say gut issues. I definitely had a lot of gut issues, and even diagnosed with herniated degenerating cervical discs and arthritis in my shoulder. Things that at the time you're definitely not connecting at all, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:29

Yeah, yeah. I think that's the thing, is that we can. It sounds I don't want to speak for you, but I know I've been like that, where I have such a high tolerance for pain and discomfort. And I'm like focused on let me just do the thing, the thing, and therefore I abandon myself, my body, all that subtle, not subtle information that your body was so desperately trying to get your attention through. Yes, literally, yeah, literally. Wow. So you shared a quote with me before that burnout isn't always about exhaustion, but a slow erosion of self-identity masked by productivity. Wow. That's a pretty loaded statement, I think. Can you take us deeper into that and help us understand what that actually looks like in someone's real life?

SPEAKER_00 7:30

Yeah, that's a great question. So again, when we're deep in it, like you said, we're just focused on the thing, especially high achievers, ambitious women. It's in you, it's built in you, it's a part of your identity, who you are, to always push through, prove through, pull through, like you said, regardless of the amount of pain you're in, right? It's just a part of the way you live and who you are. So we often, most people, at least I did, associate burnout with some type of, well, I need to get better organized, or I need a better strategy, or a better time management system. We always attribute it to that. I need more work-life balance if I could get a better job, or if I had some help at home. And so we always look to these kind of like systems as being the culprit or yeah, look out, look out here instead of looking in here. Exactly. And that goes back to again, high achievements as like our default. Looking inside is not even a thought or an option. But when we break it down to you said, how does it actually show up? For example, when someone's asking you at work or even a family member to do something that you already know you don't have the time for, you're on your last leg, you haven't eaten, you have this other long list of things to do, and then you still say yes because you have or you can't be the one to say no and let the other people down and show that you don't have it all together, and you can't do it. So something as simple as saying yes to something that your soul has it's begging you to say no to. It starts in those small ways, and then we repeat it, compound it over time, and then the next thing you know, you wake up. What the hell happened?

SPEAKER_01 9:18

Yeah. Oh my goodness. I think what's so powerful about what you're saying is that it's too easy, right? It's too easy for us to neglect ourselves to that level. That we just say, if only I could do this, please them, achieve that, right?

SPEAKER_02 9:42

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 9:43

That will take care of the chronic headaches, right? Of burnout. That is if one is I think that this is the point that I'm trying to get, is I've so often misunderstood what the information was really about. I thought it was like it was something wrong with what I was doing or how I was being. I didn't quite correlate it that uh it's I was not being in alignment with myself. Me too. And oh my goodness, how we can miss those things.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Me too.

Self-Abandonment And People-Pleasing

SPEAKER_01 10:23

You talk about high performers unconsciously self-abandoning, right? Which is, I think, is what you're describing in in pursuit of worthiness. Oh, God, have I done that? I mean, can you break that down for us? Like, how does self-abandonment actually show up in a day-to-day life?

SPEAKER_00 10:45

So, going back to a little bit about what you said earlier, with it's the small things, right? And it's so easy because it's literally our way of life. It's how we're taught, we're trained, it's a part of our conditioning, our programming. And then specifically for high performers, because we are so focused on doing the things, it could show up as simple as you've been on the computer for six, seven, eight hours straight. And the only thing that got you up was because you had to go to the bathroom. I've been there so many times. You, your body, your stomach is literally turning into a grizzly there. And you're still sitting there just working away by can just do this one last thing, knowing that there's a million other things. There's never going to be this one last thing. And then also in ways where, let's say your boss or your employer, your a colleague or co-worker asks you, can you work on the weekend or stay later and or log back on, whatever your work situation is. And you know that you have something scheduled with your kids or your partner, something else to do, but you still sign up for it, anyways, telling yourself that you can squeeze it in because you're a team player. We always like to throw around the word team player, right? And God forbid you say no because then you're not being a part of the team. Another way I would say is when you get a promotion, or maybe even a recruiter reach out to you about a role that you feel is something that's definitely calling you, but it's kind of crazy, right? Because it's in a different area, or it's somewhere located in another state, or the salary might be a little bit different. Whatever the case is that makes it different and not the rational, logical decision. You say no to it because yes, you feel lit up by it, you're excited, all the things, your soul is jumping. Yes, we really want to do this. But then you start telling yourself, but I have all these financial responsibilities, so I can't afford the 10K pay cut, or I don't feel comfortable moving to this state because you have this long list of reasons, or I've never done that line of work, so why would they want to choose me? How do I know I'm gonna be successful in it? It's just too big of a risk, type of thing. So those are like just small ways that it can show up, and you're not even thinking that you're abandoning yourself at all, right? You're thinking you're making the responsible, logical, wise, productive, efficient decision.

SPEAKER_01 13:22

Yeah. Wow. Everything you listed there, I've done to myself, that's for sure. And you're right. We like to think we're doing the smart, wise thing, the mature thing. When really all we're doing is self-sabotaging, right? Or at least not even giving ourselves a chance to consider what, as you said, if your soul, your spirit is so lit up over the possibility there's a part of you, let's say the ego or the negative talker within you that talks you out of it. Or you give over your sovereignty to please somebody else. Yeah, we kind of call that accommodating, yeah, which can be misunderstood because so often it's looked at, as you said, being a team player when really it's just another form of self-abandonment.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Yes, that's a perfect example.

SPEAKER_01 14:23

Wow, incredible. I think about like how often I've overcommitted to things, thinking that I'm capable of it all, and I don't want to let anybody down. And you talk about turning into a grizzly or zombie, something. Oh my goodness, it is just so unfortunately been so natural to do that for sake of performance, right?

SPEAKER_00 14:55

Performance, that's the word. It is, and it's in so many areas of our life, not just at work and in our career at home, yes, in our relationships with spouses or parents or children, friends, the friend invites you to the party, and you know you've had a rough week at work, and you know you don't, you barely have enough energy to get in the house, but you don't want to cancel or you don't want to say no because this is your friend. To show up for your friends. What kind of friend would you be if you you know, God forbid you said no to yeah, what kind of friend would we be to them?

SPEAKER_01 15:30

But we're not thinking about what kind of friend we are to ourselves, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 15:34

Completely abandoning our own friendship for the sake of others, and we don't even realize it at the time. Like you said, it's all these other words that we're using, but it really just boils down to self-abandonment.

Conditioning That Rewards Performance

SPEAKER_01 15:49

So, what role do you think these societal norms play in part of how we abandon ourselves?

SPEAKER_00 15:59

I would say I don't want to say a hundred percent, but for the most part, like yeah, there's some contributing factors like how we're wired in our nature, things like that. But for the most part, a lot of it is conditioning and programming for the vast majority of it. Whether it's at home with your parents and your family system, or you know, if you're religious at church and how you're what the church has to say, or the whatever the religion is, whether it's at school, school even has its own form of conditioning and programming where all of them, and wherever it is, if it's a different country or different region, I'm finding that it's all going back to the same things of control. And you mentioned sovereignty earlier. So it's completely getting rid of sovereignty, free thinking, and it's really all about controlling, keeping everybody in this box, same way, no stepping out of line, no uniqueness, like these factory type of mentality. Factory workers were on the line, you follow these steps, you do this. This is the path, this is the way, this makes sense, and anything outside of it is kind of crazy. We get stuck on that path and we don't allow ourselves any type of freedom or sovereignty, like you said, and it just boxes us in.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Oh my goodness. Yeah, a cage of our own making, in a sense, depending on which where our allegiance is. If our allegiance is more towards these different systems, whether it's the family one, the church one, the school one, the friendship one, you name it. And next thing you could be turning yourself into a pretzel trying to please all these different people.

SPEAKER_00 17:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

I'm exhausted just thinking about it.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

I know, right? It's um it's and it's so unfortunate because we started at a young age. Even if you look at toddlers, they're doing their best just trying to prove to their parents that they're a good girl or a good boy. So it's conditioning starting from the time that you can walk and talk. That and nobody's doing it on purpose. Nobody knows consciously, at least I'm not. Most of us parents aren't saying, oh, I'm consciously teaching my kid how to abandon. Yeah, you're not doing it on purpose, it's just happening, and it's like because it's getting all passed down, it's one generation after the next, and we're taught this way.

SPEAKER_01 18:36

Yeah, I was I just did a recent podcast with my daughters. I have twins that are 36 years old now, and and we were talking about what they got from their mama, and since it was just recently Mother's Day, and really got me thinking about how we do as mothers, unconsciously set our daughters up to fit in instead of question. Instead of question. Unless we're really conscious about how we ourselves are doing that. I don't know how else we would be aware of that. So it's a really good point.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

We wouldn't, right? We wouldn't. And that's why so many people, so many women are suffering because they were raised by women that didn't know. I went on this journey of trying to discover myself because of my daughter. Because I wanted to break generational curses, so to speak, with my mom and her mom. But it wasn't, I started out doing therapy and the mental health side of things, and I didn't go deep into the identity work and nervous system regulation and how all of those things come into play until probably within the last three, four years. So it's like you just don't, you just don't know.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

Yeah. It is true what they say, that it's all connected, right? Yet I think, and we'll talk about nervous system, just how much dregulation that the our systems go through, our personal nervous system goes through because of what we are acting towards. But uh, I do want to just touch on the role that performance plays in this whole self-abandonment, right? We we perform to the level that I don't really know what that looks like. I think that everybody is a little different, although we're all trying to reach for something. Share with us a little bit about what you've come to learn about how just the pressure of performance plays in self-abandonment.

SPEAKER_00 20:44

So pressure specifically and performance for high achievers, ambitious women, high performing women, it's it shows up a little bit differently and it hits a little bit differently because your identity is proving. Your identity is achieving it is performance that's literally a part of who you are when you're operating from that survival mode space, anyways. So performance is it is safety for you. It feels safe to perform because you've gotten rewarded off of the performance, whether it was the accolades at work or a bonus or whatever, or love at home. You've gotten some type of reward from the performance. So you associate performance with safety, you per associate it with rewards, you associate it with fulfillment. That is success. That is the thing for you in that space, anyways, because that's what it is associated with you. So that's why the performance is so significant, so prevalent, so important when you're a high performing, high achieving woman operating from the survival based identity, because this is all it is, right?

SPEAKER_01 22:00

Yeah, I think about what we were just talking about in terms of what we have done unconsciously to our daughters or what was unconsciously passed down to us. And it does start young that we teach our children how to behave a certain way and we reward them for that behavior. And then they go into the school system and they get, of course, rewarded for good behavior. They also get rewarded for a certain amount of performance when it comes to reading, writing, exactly participation. And that keeps getting ratchet up the further along they get in that school system. And then when we fast forward to when we're in career performing, it is similarly rewarded. And if we are surviving, we have a direct link with the reward, which is the outcome, and survival. And so we will say that if we don't achieve, we aren't safe.

SPEAKER_00 23:08

We aren't safe, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

Wow. And it doesn't matter what it costs us.

SPEAKER_00 23:14

Right. At the end of the day, especially considering that our safety is on the line, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:19

Yeah, it's incredible what we too easily give over.

Survival Mode In Relationships

SPEAKER_01 23:24

So let's take this to the personal level, like relationships, okay? Because a lot of the people that I work with, and certainly my own personal history, I for sake of safety, stayed in a marriage where I was really unhappy. And because it was safe financially, lifestyle-wise, I wasn't ready to be uh accountable to myself. And what that cost me from uh a worthiness, a self-esteem level was so it's hard to even measure, but took me a long time to recover from that. So share with us what your thoughts are on what high performers will do, how this translates into their personal life.

SPEAKER_00 24:14

I'm the same as you. I also was married, now divorced, stayed in the marriage far too long, definitely abandoned myself. And I would say one of the highest costs for me was probably self-trust. I no longer trusted myself, especially when it came to making big decisions, because I had made such a terrible choice with that decision. And instead of just seeing it as this was a lesson, a learning opportunity, you can choose again. All these negative things associated with it, which it wasn't at the time I didn't know that, of course. But that is kind of what kept me there because not only was it a safety thing, but then it was also can I trust myself to choose again? What if I choose wrong again? I don't have I'm getting up there in age, I don't have time to waste to choose to choose all these things coming through. So it was kind of like that saying it's better the devil you know than the one you don't know. So that then becomes the new safety, even though technically you feel uncomfortable and all the things like you said, I felt we feel it right, but it still feels like the safer option as opposed to the unknown.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

So what here's the bottom line. Do you even think it was a conscious choice?

SPEAKER_00 25:46

Not at all.

SPEAKER_01 25:47

Yeah, that's how I felt feel about it too. It's like you earlier on today, we were talking about how high performers will abandon themselves and talk them out of something that lights them up because it doesn't feel safe or it doesn't make sense logically. I think the same thing is true in some of these survival moments, right? Whether it's staying in a marriage or a relationship that you're no longer happy in or you feel fulfilled with, or a career, right? Or any situation where you stay well beyond what makes sense. I don't know that's conscious. I think there's this primal part of us that can keep us stuck.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

Yeah. Absolutely. I definitely I agree with that. I see that and I experienced it. And now I know that's a part of our system, the nervous system kicking in to kind of keep us safe. So it does, for as long as it can, anyways, it does keep that part of information from our consciousness. Because once we find out and once we wake up, our souls won't let us stay stuck anymore. So it's also the nervous system in the background trying to keep it hidden as a part of that safety, which is why we have no clue that we're even doing it.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

Yeah. Oh my goodness, girl, I tell you, it's true. I think I think that what I've learned recently is that the nervous system, which we're going to talk about here right now, is it uh it operates from history, right? It's it's it's and yet at the same time, it's only revealing to you as much as you can understand in the moment to do something. I think it's almost there's some level of tolerance that we cultivate again that we put up with right in order to just survive. But there there comes a point where that no longer works. And thank goodness, right? Thank goodness, and you're pushed towards seeking help or working on it.

Nervous System Safety And Feelings

SPEAKER_01 28:05

And so let's talk about the nervous system and how its place in all this. Like, how does it start to activate change in people? What do you think?

SPEAKER_00 28:21

So with the nervous system, and not to we don't go into a whole science lesson, but in terms of the protection side of things on the parasympathetic side, and we have the four responses, the typical responses, and that's specifically that side of the nervous system is specifically safety focused. We there's the rest and digest side where it's chill, calm, relaxed, and then the other side, if something's happening, we need to keep you safe. And so our nervous system is essentially all the time in the background the thing that's saying, we're cool here, we're fine now, or it's dangerous, we need to get out of here, one or the other. And it's doing that for every little thing across the board that we do. Literally everything, the food we eat, the places we go, the shows we watch, the people we interact with, all the things. So anything that is essential that is essentially categorized as unknown or unfamiliar or foreign, it's gonna automatically be put in the safe, unsafe category. Because, like you said, the nervous system is going based off of the past experiences. That's how it collects this information and figures out, okay, which one are we in right now? Whether it's actually happening or not, it's just perception based off the past. And so when we are operating in these spaces where we're burned out or we're overwhelmed, exhausted, tired, all these things, and that's what we've been doing for the past five, 10, 15, 20 years, our system has now seen this as the new safe space. At first, it most likely presented as dangerous, and that was not okay. But then once we, it's our norm, that's safety to us, that's that's our happy zone.

SPEAKER_01 30:15

So what I was just gonna say, I think what can happen, particularly, let's just say we're somebody who grows up in trauma, right? Our system can get a little burnt out, or maybe, or a little stuck in that fight or flight mode. Right. And I don't know about you. For me, because I had such a dregulated system that was always ready for the next bad thing to happen, right? That I I lost track of what rest and digest actually felt like. Yeah. And I think that's something that I'm interested in hearing from your point of view, what role that plays in why we ignore what is happening.

SPEAKER_00 31:06

And specifically, you mean what role are you referring to?

SPEAKER_01 31:12

Like signals in life, like, for example, just whether you you you feel unhappy in a relationship or you feel burnt out, overwhelmed, overworked, underfed, underrested, any one of those things, it feels normal after a while, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_00 31:31

It does. And going, you made a great point. It's like the rest and digest side, the calm side is you it's turned off. It's enabled, disabled, it's offline, you can't reach it.

SPEAKER_01 31:45

Yeah, I had to start practicing activating it.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

Actually, you you have to. You that is something that you actually literally have to do to your point once you do get in that space, but it has it has literally just logged off.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Yeah. Wow, yeah. I think just coming getting back into my body. Because tell me what role being analytical, because high performers are very analytical, does that play in this whole nervous system dysregulation?

SPEAKER_00 32:20

That one is a tricky one for us high achievers, right? Because we can always explain something away or rationalize it away or make it make sense type of way. When a lot of what we're talking about, it may not be what they say is the rational, logical thing. Like when we were talking about the subtle ways that it all shows up, it's like there's no way that's connected to why you're feeling this way. But it really is. So we become so analytical to the point that we miss the subtle things. We overlook those things because we're so hyper focused on the big things, the obvious things that the little things become insignificant or unimportant or dismissed or just swept under the rug. And then they eventually pile up. And that's when they come out in all these different ways. We just can't take it anymore.

SPEAKER_01 33:17

Yeah. I think it's interesting because this is what when I was work I worked as a therapist for a number of decades with people who were caught in an addiction cycle. And they definitely had a dysregulated system. They sought whatever it was that they were addicted to to help them keep from feeling. And so speak a little bit about what the role feelings play in letting us know what our nervous system is so desperately trying to tell us.

SPEAKER_00 33:52

So our feelings are, I see them now as like our compass, like our little messengers. But before I went on this journey, I actually thought of them as monsters that I had to keep under control. Monsters. Whoa. Monsters. I hated showing, experiencing any type of strong and strong emotion. And that's on both ends of the spectrum, including joy and excitement. It was like I always needed to manage, control my emotions because they're the things that got me into trouble and they're the things that got me off track.

SPEAKER_01 34:30

So you labeled them as unsafe.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

As unsafe monsters. So just imagine anytime a and a feeling comes up and my brain is saying, Oh, the monsters are back. Like that in and of itself is sending my entire body, my entire system into this frenzy alarm mode, right? Because the feelings, the emotions, they're all everything attached to not just on a even an intellectual, mental level, but on a physiological level in terms of the neurotransmitters, the chemicals, everything that's run into our body is either attached to, we could just label them as quote unquote good or bad. You're pushing out these good chemicals throughout your body or these quote unquote bad chemicals depending on these feelings. And feelings are meant to just be experienced as waves that we hop on and hop off, and that keeps a balanced nervous system. But like me, a lot of us will get stuck and on the feeling that was meant to be temporary for a long time because I had been labeling them as monsters and I had not been allowing myself to feel them. So then I just got stuck on the sad train, for example, for years.

SPEAKER_01 35:47

So there's this expression, what we resist persists, right? So resisting feeling the sadness, the grief, whatever it was that was behind that was keeping you stuck there.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

Keeping me stuck. And I had no clue. I'm thinking that I'm helping myself move forward by ignoring this thing.

SPEAKER_01 36:09

Wow. Yeah. I've been there. Again, I worked as a therapist and I was a high-performing, high-functioning, helping people access their feelings. And I can admit this now, but I couldn't then. The real reason why I was functioning so well and helping people so was because I wanted, I avoided feeling. And I somehow convinced myself that if I help people access their feelings, that would make me okay. And it's not true. It was just another rationalization that high performers can make to say, I'm going to help this person achieve what they struggle to achieve. And then therefore, by association, I'm so better when the truth is no girl, you just have to feel take time, feel. But my schedule didn't allow it because I was so confused. Oh my gosh, yeah. Feelings, there's something else. There can feel like monsters, but they certainly are the key to healing, right?

SPEAKER_00 37:27

Absolutely. Another saying I that I got from therapy was that feeling is healing.

unknown 37:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 37:33

Have you heard that one? Yes. And that one was tough for me to accept because I was like, I don't know about that. Feeling is painful.

SPEAKER_01 37:40

Yeah. When it's painful because what you're basically, in order to access a feeling, we have to be willing to let it all the way in.

SPEAKER_00 37:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 37:53

And we can tell ourselves a story that if we are that vulnerable, that's not safe.

SPEAKER_00 38:00

It's not safe, especially specifically, high achieving, high-performing women. Yes. Vulnerability, at least for me, I don't know about you. It's like that is the last thing on the list you're ever trying to be.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

Right. Let's think about it. In today's society, or certainly women, we tend to think that the way we can be successful is if we build this armor around us that and then go out into the world and where no one can get to us or nothing can get to us. Yes. And the challenge is that if we don't let things in, if we don't let feelings move through, we do end up getting stuck.

SPEAKER_00 38:46

We do. I definitely did. And I found for me that was also going back to self-trust, tied to my self-trust, because I didn't trust myself enough to feel, allow myself to feel, and still be okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:59

Yeah. Yeah. I think that's a circular thinking, right? And and so, you know, we're talking a lot about how we tend to think our way through things as opposed to really feel it. So tell me that you mentioned something before to in a previous conversation

Embodied Healing Builds Self-Trust

SPEAKER_01 39:19

with me. There's a difference between knowing something and actually living it. So, can you explain the difference between intellectual awareness and embodied healing?

SPEAKER_00 39:33

So, knowing something is more so on the you've memorized it, you can describe it, you identify it, maybe even teach it, right? Because you have all the philosophies or the principles behind the values, whatever it is, you know it on the conscious intellectual level. But embodying it, living it, it's more so like autopilot. Whereas if you memorize something, you have to recollect what it is or be able to say it or speak it out loud versus embodying it, it's autopilot the way you're moving, even if you're not really focused. If you've ever been driving a car and then your mind drifted off, and then the next thing you know, you're like down the road and you don't even remember driving the past minute or so. It's like that feeling where it's literally you're on autopilot, it's a part of who you are. It's integrated into your being, like literally your cells, your organs, your tissues, like every part of you, your whole entire being is on board with this thing, and it's actually a part of who you are. So it's just how you live. You don't have to remember it, recollect, think about it, pause, train, prepare anymore. Like it's literally who you are, your way of life.

SPEAKER_01 40:56

So that requires, I imagine, consistency, right? Consistency and practice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:03

Consistency and practice. And it's not to say that you'll always be quote unquote perfect and never revert back to habits of the old identity or the old self, but because you are in this new embodied space, even when those old things present itself, you respond and react in a completely different way. So it's not that you're like regressing or going backwards or something's gone wrong or something's broke. It's just another opportunity and a lesson for you to double down or triple down on the growth and progress that you've made. And now it's like a new lesson or a new opportunity for growth with this same habit that wasn't there before because you're now this whole new identity.

SPEAKER_01 41:48

Okay. And so speak to how that affects your self-trust. Meaning specifically when you begin, when you really embody it versus just versus just knowing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:04

So then for me, as I'm going through it now, and I would say each day my trust grows as I fall more and more in love with myself. And like, and it's definitely not a perfect straight journey. It's ups and downs all the time. But every time there's a little bit deep down, you definitely do come back up. I will say that. But self-trust is night and day. You can now, I can now make decisions, the scary decisions that make no sense that everybody else is telling you it's crazy. You can make those decisions, trusting your own gut, your own knowing, your own soul, your own intuition. Just based off of that, you don't need experts, you don't need a guru, external approval, parents, you don't need any of those things because you now have you're so connected with who you are, all aspects of you that you know your truth and where you're going. So now when it comes to the decisions along the journey, they're in alignment. So you're no longer afraid to make those decisions because even if I don't want to say the wrong decision is made, but even if it's a decision that doesn't lead to the outcome you really want, you trust yourself to handle that and still move forward and walk through it.

SPEAKER_01 43:18

Okay. Yeah, it sounds like there's a big space between beginning the healing journey and when you get to a level where you're really trusting yourself. So let's talk about that. What are some ways that people can get started when they feel like their life is out of alignment? And then and what is what are some of the maybe mild stones that they can look towards along the way?

SPEAKER_00 43:49

So the first part of the question was what are things people can do to get started on their journey, right? And going back to, I do want to touch a little bit on what you said about it. Sounds like there's a huge gap. It does sound like it, but it's really not as huge as you might think it is because it all it takes is that first time when you say yes to your gut, your soul, yourself, essentially. It could literally be just that party invite. That one time where you say no, I can't go. You don't overexplain, you just don't go. That one yes to yourself and your soul that puts you on the path to self-trust. Just that one initial decision.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

So it's not saying no to them, but really saying yes.

SPEAKER_00 44:35

Yes to yourself. Yes. Um, and thinking of it that way, every time you say no, in general, we're saying yes to something else, and vice versa. Just pausing to take the time to think when and how and where am I actually saying yes to myself versus focusing on saying yes to all these other people, places, and things in my life. So I wanted to say that at least that in and of itself puts you on the self-trust path. You don't have to be on the quote unquote other side to be practicing it.

unknown 45:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 45:09

But the question going back to what you said about the fur, I think you said what's the first step.

SPEAKER_01 45:15

That what is if people realize that their life is out of alignment, like they're burnout or they're unhappy, or there's feelings stuck, right? What are some ways that they can begin to start unpacking this and get themselves on the road towards becoming more self-loving and more self-trusting?

Simple Tools For Alignment

SPEAKER_00 45:37

So I would say the simplest, easiest way might sound cliche, but is to first ask yourself, are you happy? A lot of times, especially as adults, we're adulting. So we don't even think we have the right to be happy because happiness is for children. It's privileged, childish thinking. We have responsibilities and bills. We don't have we can't afford to be happy right now, right? So that simple question, am I happy? That in and of itself will tell you so much. And allow yourself to ask the question guilt-free. Like you don't have to explain if you're not happy why you're not happy or justify why you should be grateful. None of that. Literally ask the question, the answer that comes up, the first response, that's it. Don't justify or rationalize it. And then ask yourself, what would make me happy? What is one little thing that I can do today, or that if I received today or if I saw today, what would actually create happiness for me?

SPEAKER_01 46:40

That's a great point. I think the work that I've done with clients, particularly women who are older, is that they're still doing things that make them unhappy. And they'll have lots of reasons why, right? I don't want to let somebody down, or I've got to work and pay the bills, and or I don't want to disappoint somebody. I made these plans, I've got to follow through, et cetera. And I remind people all the time, and I even had to get into the practice of reminding me, I only want to do what makes me happy. I have three grown children. They're, as far as I'm concerned, in charge of their own happiness now. And so I deserve to be happy, and I have to own that. I can't wait for someone else to make me happy. Look to something else to make me happy. I've got to do that. And so talk a little bit about once once you answer that question, what are some possible tools that people can use to really start doing some of this deeper work?

SPEAKER_00 47:49

To the thing that you just said, I want to point out that everything you described with your clients and the things that they've been saying, yet another example of self-abandonment, not even knowing it, right? Nah. It's crazy how it just creeps and sneaks in, but that is the perfect example of how we abandon ourselves and all these subtle ways and don't even know it.

SPEAKER_01 48:10

Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:12

But to your question, so what's the next step, right? You've done that, you said I'm not, you found out you're not happy, so now what? The next thing I would I've always always try to walk people through is creating some sort of vision that does make you happy because it's like you know you aren't. You kind of said listed a few things that would potentially make you happy, right? But what does that actually look like from a lived perspective? You have a list of things, but you know, now what? So then it becomes more so about everybody's not career focused. It might be parenting, it might be whatever your thing is. The next step would be to ask yourself to allow yourself to create a vision that is expansive. So if you could do anything, if you could be anything, if you could have anything, and allow yourself to fill in those three prompts. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 49:08

Using your imagination to help you maybe shift the perspective.

SPEAKER_00 49:15

Yes. Yes, because I found that people in that space, even myself, it's hard for you to even get in imagination or visualization mode simply because you have been so focused on that high performance, especially high achievers, you've been so focused on proving, achieving, going down this path, checking the boxes, all the things that have led you to abandoning yourself that you're so disconnected from the truth of what your actual dreams are. How can you manifest, create them, bring them into reality if you don't even allow yourself to know what they are? And full circle, going back to the nervous system thing, it's also a part of the nervous system safety because you had these dreams, but your nervous system was like, that doesn't sound safe. So it's covering it up so that you aren't really connecting to it and seeing it. Because again, once once you're awake, your soul is not gonna let it let you go without addressing it.

SPEAKER_01 50:15

Yeah, I think what a hear coming up here requires a lot of willingness to be the honest. To be honest, yeah. Yeah, about what you really want or what's not making you happy.

SPEAKER_00 50:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:31

And I think in my experience in my own life, I really struggled with being that honest with myself, right? Because I lived too long in denial of the thing that was really behind all my unhappiness. And yeah, so talk a little bit about that.

SPEAKER_00 50:51

I can relate to that so much, and I've found that it's even underneath the honesty is permission because we we just don't give our, especially women. We've been taught to do all the things, be all the things for everyone but ourselves. So we've outsourced our permission to even say we can be honest with ourselves because that would be selfish, that would be greedy, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

Putting yourself first, putting yourself first. Oh my goodness, it does go against all of these norms that we survived with within all the systems of our life. That's it. Survive, that's how we survive. And what I hear a word that I like to use is we're asking, we're shifting from survival to thriving, yeah, standing. Yeah, and that can feel, to your point, unsafe for a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 51:49

Very unsafe, not even just unsafe, and in some cases, like mine, just wrong, just bad. Like you don't even have the right to like, how dare you give yourself permission to just be and do and have all these things.

SPEAKER_01 52:06

Oh my goodness. Yeah, so getting back to what permission, denial, going from survival to thriving to expansion. It's like a whole new world that we're recreating. So let's talk about this idea of rebuilding from wholeness as opposed to hustle, because that's something that I used to actually pride myself on. What a hustler I was. Oh, I'm the get it done girl, right? That's something to hang my hat on. And it really struck me when you said that there's a difference between build rebuilding from wholeness and versus fixing yourself through hustle. So can you expand on that a little bit for me and our listeners?

SPEAKER_00 52:53

Yeah, and I laugh because I was just like you. That was definitely me too. It's like a whole hustle culture culture, right? But hustle mode is essentially that survival identity, the survival-based identity that we've been talking about, right? Definitely not thriving. Wholeness, on the other hand, is coming from that thriving space because now, as you live your life, as you make your choices, as you move forward, you're moving from a space of being connected to yourself, being in trust and love, all the things with yourself. That's where the wholeness part comes from. You can now move forward from that whole space as opposed to misaligned, you're operating from survival. There's a disconnect, there's an imbalance. You're not choosing, moving, acting from all of you, the true whole self of who you really are.

SPEAKER_01 53:50

Yeah, I definitely can understand that because that's also teaching your nervous system how to relax. Exactly. Or teaching you to listen to your nervous system, even importantly, right? So, wholeness as a practice, let's just say like a daily practice, what does that look like?

SPEAKER_00 54:14

I know some people are listening, they're probably like, oh my God, that is a lot. I'm never gonna be whole, I'm never gonna be able to do any of these things. It's just too hard. I give up already. Because that was me too. But no, I one of the things that I've learned along the way is it's the simplest, smallest thing that makes the biggest impact when it comes to the type of stuff we're talking about, which is a mind-blowing concept for us high-performing, high-achieving, ambitious people, because we're so used to doing the hard things and all the things that there's no way something simple could actually work, right?

SPEAKER_01 54:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:54

So for me, the small, simple thing, literally, you can have a five-minute morning routine. So whatever your thing is, maybe it's coffee, it's tea, it's water, whatever your thing is, something to drink in the morning before you get out of bed, set an intention to get you on track, get you on path, and then take at least two or three minutes to just pause. Like we were saying earlier, we wouldn't give ourselves a moment to just pause and feel. Give yourself a moment to wake up and pause and feel and think. And just literally all that can be done within the first few minutes of you waking up five minutes, and then that in and of itself, just starting the day in that space, it sets the intention for the rest of the day. So then you're operating and moving from that frequency, you're drawing and attracting things that are in alignment with that frequency, and it puts you in the space to now start out. Of course, we're not perfect, right? Things will happen, you'll get off track, all the things, but it at least sets the tone for the day to at least get you started in that space.

SPEAKER_01 55:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:56

And it's something that you could simple quickly do.

SPEAKER_01 55:59

Yeah, my morning ritual definitely sets a trajectory for my day. And you're right, things still come up and take me out of alignment. And I think that what I had to do, and I don't know if this is something that you do, I check in with myself. I actually set an alarm on my phone a couple times, and I had to teach myself this is not something I naturally did. To pause, breathe. How do I feel? And then if I'm feeling dysregulated, I do either some breaths or some affirmations or some journaling, something to get me back on track, prayer, whatever works, get outside in nature, something. And like you, it the idea being, it doesn't take a lot of time, it just takes a lot of consistency.

SPEAKER_00 56:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:56

Because toward rebuilding trust with myself began with me practicing things that were gonna show me my nervous system, my little younger versions of myself that are still in my psyche, that I am trustworthy that I can take care of me in all these instead of keep going back to self-abandoning me. Yeah. So, what are some practices that you do in your day besides starting your day off to help you attend to you with the morning ritual?

SPEAKER_00 57:32

So, yes, I have a morning ritual. I also have a bedtime one. Do I always do them perfectly? No, I just want to throw that out there for somebody that's listening. They get an I'll have another day. Progress, not perfection, because you know how high performers can get, then that healing all of a sudden becomes the new toxic thing because you're like, you know, you're like, I didn't heal right, and now you're beating yourself up because you missed your morning routine and you missed the whole point, right? Failed that that has been me too. I had to correct myself with no, we're healing.

SPEAKER_01 58:08

You're losing your self-grace.

SPEAKER_00 58:10

That's right. While we're on this journey, that's right. Stop doing these things, but I do the check-ins just like you

Somatic Practices And Daily Rituals

SPEAKER_00 58:17

said. I have a timer on my phone too. So I'll do that. I also journal the same as you. I do somatic work, somatic exercises. That has been a big one for me in terms of moving the energy out of my body. So going back to the nervous system, it keeps popping up what you said earlier about how the nervous system goes based off of our the past experiences. And when we have these experiences, the energy can get stuck and stored in our body, not especially somebody like me who's seeing feelings and emotions monsters and not wanting to process them, then they get stuck. So the somatic work has really helped me push and move the stuck energy out of my body. And somatic work for people that are listening, it's uh designed to support the somatic side of the nervous system, but it can be done with physical exercises, gentle exercises, and then also writing, like journaling type of things, too. So that meditation has been a big one. I do a lot of Joe Dispens. Are you familiar with him?

SPEAKER_01 59:29

I am.

SPEAKER_00 59:30

So before I found him, meditation was a struggle for me. But after, like, I literally couldn't even meditate for 30 seconds. But after doing his course and all of those things and his audios, that has really helped a lot rewiring my nervous system. And like you said, when things happen throughout the day, if you take the time to meditate, even if it's a few minutes, you don't have to do a long meditation, makes a huge difference. Journaling, I do energy work, acupuncture is another thing, and also cupping has helped me just to throw those things out there.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:05

Great great tools, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I find anything that gets you back into your body, right? And out of your head. Yeah, because honestly, I had spent in too much time living above my neck and not below my head. And now that I've committed, self-committed to this whole healing process, which took me, I started this journey over 20 years ago and closer to 30 years ago, and I started meditating and it took a while for that to stick. And then I tried all these other modalities, which now are thankfully a part of my everyday life. But back then they were just like a foreign land, a foreign practice, foreign language, and that I found my way in and out of. But the consistency matters because I feel like to the point of self-trust, that's really the way we heal, is it is by showing ourselves, our body, our nervous systems, our little persons inside of us that we can do this. Yes, and it takes us showing up for ourselves, yeah, yes, and so talk a little bit about your book because we

Book Framework And Free Gift

SPEAKER_01 1:01:25

haven't really we mentioned it at the beginning falling madly in self-love. What is this telling the journey of your healing process or what is it within them?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:36

What is it about? So it does include a lot of different stories about my own personal journey and my challenges. However, it walks you through your own journey and your own path to fall in love with yourself using the it's a framework that I came up with for the absolute self-love framework. And it includes 12 pillars. So I take you on this journey where we're essentially going together and you're walking through these pillars building a map back home to yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:09

Okay, so it's a great tool, it sounds for people who want to start this healing process. Absolutely to learn how to find their way back to themselves. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:21

Absolutely. So the book in itself, it includes a bunch of different tools and practices at the end of each chapter so that you can actually take action and get start practicing and embodying them. So it's literally a book made for the reader, for you in your own journey and walking yourself home with me simply as just being the guide and sharing my experiences, my stories, and how I have been able to travel it so far myself.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:52

Wow. I love that. I love that. I think it's a really important tool because, again, like I said, I started learning about all these different practices so long ago. And yet I think I was on the verge, I was on something new, and it wasn't quite trend trending yet in the world, and certainly not in my circles, right? And so everyone thought I was a little kooky meditation, what's that? Or and luckily, a lot of these things are more mainstream now, like cupping and acupuncture, as you said, and other things, somatic work. Yet it's great that all of this is in the book. And you mentioned to me before we started recording today, it's available as an audio.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:38

Yes, yes, it's on Audible, and it's also on Kindle as well as an ebook. Oh, to make sure it was available because everybody's different in terms of how we like to receive information. So I wanted to make sure I had all forms available. I love that.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:53

Yeah, because high performing women are busy. So we'll come up with an excuse why we can't get to the healing. I don't have time. I don't want to leave any excuses. Oh my goodness. Wow. You had this phrase that says self-remembrance, it feels softer than reinvention. And I love that because I think about how it is like coming home to yourself, right? Remembering who you are. And so speak a little bit about that as we start to wind down here.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:30

So I guess on my journey, I a lot of and you've probably heard it too. People always talk about you have to become someone new and you have to kill the old and different variations of that frame of thought. And as I went on this journey and the downloads and everything came to me to write the book. And and it wasn't the order that it's in now, is not the order that it came to me to write it in. So I didn't see this fully at the time when I was writing it. But hindsight, as more and more chapters came in and I got closer to the end, I saw it really as we're not trying to become someone new or different, or any of the things that fix something were broken, none of those things. Literally, who we are innately, divinely, regardless of where you're born, sex, religion, like all those things, who we are is so powerful, so limitless, so infinite divine that it's more so remembering, getting back to remembering how this journey started in the first place, who we were at that starting point before the conditioning, the programming, the things that we talked about that got us to this place in the first place. If we could just remember who we were before all of that crap, then that in and of itself changes everything. So for me, it was also about stripping myself of. The guilt and shame that came along with making the wrong turns or the bad choices or the bad mistakes, because that was all a part of the path and the journey, and nothing's gone wrong, nothing's bad, and everything's happening for us.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:13

So there's some forgiveness work you had to do. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:17

Lots of forgiveness work, lots of compassion work, which is also in my book, there's a self-forgiveness and a self-compassion chapter. But it really, I found that it was really more so about remembering because we just forgot who and what we were, as opposed to people saying we're broken or we need to become this new thing. It's no, we just actually forgot the truth. And then once we remember the truth, then we're back in that whole place, which we never truly left. It's just that we were forgot that we were already whole.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:46

Yeah, I love that. I've read somewhere that so much of our dysregulation in our nervous systems is all about the fact that we forget, we forgot who we were. And so we start this journey, this path offline, so to speak, performing, achieving, yeah, and we keep building from that. And it's almost and it's on a false foundation because it's not in alignment with who we really are. And so, yeah, you're right. Often we'll we could easily buy into the fact that if I'm out of alignment, that means I have to become something new and different, as opposed to just let go of who we think we are in order to become who we might be, which is who we really were all along. All along.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:41

And it's so crazy because it's like it sounds easy because essentially we're just saying just be yourself, but it is the hardest thing, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:50

To be true to you, yeah, means you have to stop performing.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:54

Yeah, and then that means for us high achievers, that means you are outside of the safety zone, and it's all these bread alert danger signs, not performing, then who am I?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:06

Yeah, yeah. Oh boy, but this could be a whole other episode that we could talk about because I live in New York City and I am surrounded by high-achieving women who uh really would invite me to become more like them. And I'm actually don't want to, which can make me come across as being very antisocial, and so what I have to do to be true to me is to pick and choose the opportunities that feel safe for me to be me, and and say yes to those and no to everything else, and be okay with not being uh seen as one of them.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:59

So that's no more fitting in. No more fitting in.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:03

I love I absolutely love that. I love that for you, and it kind of wraps up the whole conversation nicely because that's the work, right? Being you regardless of if they're gonna say she she's rude or she doesn't want to participate. Instead of just accepting you as you are, they're saying all these things, and you're like, it is what it is. You're saying yes to you regardless, and that is amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:29

Yeah, it's definitely taken time for me to get here, but I can tell you, and we can I share this with my listeners all the time, that the best journey has been arriving at the knowing that I know who I am, yeah, and I know what's right for me, and I have all the practices in place that are there to help keep me balanced, but more importantly, help catch me when I get out of balance. And so, you as you mentioned already today, like we're gonna get out of alignment. So we better have a plan, a practice, an intention that's back on track so that we continue on that healing process and building more self-trust. Wow, this has been an amazing, powerful conversation. And it's so good to get to know you and hear more about this work because there are so many people out there in my listenership alone, but more and more that I'm meeting people that really don't know who they are and don't know what to do about that, about the fact that they don't feel happy, they don't understand the connection.

Find Jasmine And Final Request

SPEAKER_01 1:10:46

So, before we let you go, tell everyone how they can find you and find your book.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:53

So, my book is on Amazon. Like I said earlier, you can get it Kindle, paperback, or Audible all on Amazon. So if you have the memberships, you can use your credits. And then where I'm found, you can find me on Instagram, you can find me on LinkedIn, Jasmine Kiana. That's my handle everywhere. And feel free to shoot me a DM. I would love to hear from you guys. And even if you have questions about my book, I actually have I told Jennifer I have a gift for your audience. I don't know if she shared it with you yet.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:25

Oh, share it.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:27

Okay, well, I do have a gift that I'm gonna give you the link if you want to add it in your show notes. Including the first chapter in the intro of my book. For people that like physical or paper copy, I'll have it digitally available. And then for those that prefer audio, then they'll have access to that audio chapter.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:46

I love that. Thank you so much. I think everyone loves the free gift, right? So and it's a little bit of an exposure to it, so that then they can choose to jump in all the way after that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:00

Yeah. And even within that first part, there is a practice at the end. That in and of itself would going back to the questions you asked me earlier about how to get started, even just reading that one chapter and doing that one practice, that in and of itself will absolutely help you get started on your journey.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:16

Oh, that's great. Wow. Thank you so much for joining us today and jumping into this conversation. This has really been wonderful. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:25

Thank you so much for having me. It's been so much fun. And I love all your questions. It's fun when you are a guest on a show and they ask really insightful, fun questions that takes the conversation all over the place, but then it always magically comes back full circle. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:44

Thank you. I really have enjoyed this, and it's great getting to know you because I see me in you. We are very much on that path together. So I want to speak to my listeners. I want to just say if this conversation resonated with you, please share it with someone you care about because someone you love, someone who might quietly be showing up as a high performer outside of themselves, but inside they are out of alignment or they don't give themselves permission or they're feeling dysregulated and they need some help coming home to themselves. And if you haven't already, take a moment to like and review the podcast. It helps more people find these episodes and conversations and begin their own healing journey. You've been listening to She Asks Tools for Practical Hope. I'm your host, Anna McBride. And until soon, be well.